What's the Next Right Step?

Are you more the logical, action-focused, checklist-loving kind of woman… or are you more like the aligned with the universe, manifesting, little bit woo woo type? Or maybe you’re like today’s guest — a healthy balance of both.

Renee Bowen is a professional photographer & coach for creative female entrepreneurs. Her photography career has spanned over 20 years, with a speciality in branding & portrait photography. She holds a degree in Psychology as well as certifications in NLP Life Coaching, Neuro-encoding, Hypnosis & The Amen Clinics Brain Training. Renee calls her style of coaching “tried and true + dash of woo” because she integrates proven, scientific strategies with a good helping of the metaphysical. Clients often come to her for help with marketing and business coaching, but also walk away with a rewired and regulated nervous system. 

Connect with Renee on Instagram or online at ReneeBowen.com  

Transcript

Episode Title: WHAT’S THE NEXT RIGHT STEP?

Guest: Renee Bowen

Episode Link: https://grownasswoman.guide/episode183/

I have a question. Do you consider yourself more the logical action-focused, checklist kind of woman? Or are you more like the “aligned with the universe” manifesting, little bit woo-woo type? Or maybe, you're like today's guest: a healthy balance of both. 

Renee Bowen is host of the podcast Tried and True with a Dash of Wu where she integrates proven scientific strategies with a good helping of the metaphysical. Renee has been a photographer for two decades. In fact, she takes all of my professional and personal photos. But she's also a certified life coach and she's trained in neuro and coding, hypnosis, and brain training. In this episode, she shares her thoughts on everything from regulating our nervous systems, to how we can bring in more income using our natural gifts and talents. I think you'll really enjoy this conversation.

[00:00:56] Jackie: If I open up my Instagram right now, I will probably see many posts about the hustle, how we need to hustle, and then I will see the equal number of posts about how we sit back and manifest and let all of the good blessings come into our life. You do both. How did that come to be?

[00:01:25] Renee: I don't know, maybe it's my Libra rising, but I've always wanted like, like this balance. And I think that is kind of a myth. Like, I kind of think more of that now, like, as a grown-ass woman, you know, I kind of wanted balance my whole life, but really it's just integration that I was really seeking. It's not that I'm anti-hustle culture, because I really do believe that we do need to take action unless you actually do the thing and take the step, even when it's scary, it's not gonna get done.

[00:01:53] Renee: But equally important is this energetic imprint that we're putting out, of abundance and alignment and inner peace. And if we are not regulated in our nervous system and with everything and in alignment, the hustle culture will never work. Right?

[00:02:12] Renee: So I really do believe that, there's probably a lot of people out there who have, like, railroaded their way to their dream business, but I really do believe that's a huge recipe for burnout, and I see that a lot. And you probably do too.

[00:02:28] Jackie: Yes. Is it kind of the combination of doing and being, a little bit?

[00:02:32] Renee: Yeah. That's a really good way to put it, because I believe you have to embody what you want. 

[00:02:38] Renee: You'll hear people say things like, “I'll never be able to get that,” or “I'll never achieve this number” or whatever it is. But that's all because of something that happened in their past, right? There was something that happened that an experience or experiences that shape us to believe that it is true.

[00:02:58] Renee: And so the embody and the being part of it, I think really comes into play when you decide, no, I really want to embody this future version of myself. This me, who does have it, this me who, has reached that goal, or whatever it is. How can I align with her energetic imprint?

[00:03:17] Jackie: Hmm. 

[00:03:18] Renee: That's the woo part. Like, and it's not even just the woo, it's kind of science, it's quantum physics. Like you can kind of jump time really, because you're matching that future version of you, if that makes sense. But as the woo side, like if that's too big and, and too…

[00:03:35] Jackie: But you know, I, I like to say I'm 30% woo.

[00:03:38] Renee: I'm 30%.

[00:03:41] Renee: But you know, a lot of people are like, what if that's too much? Then at least start by just embodying, at least being aware of “Am I coming from a place of my past? Am I working from the past or am I working toward my future?” At least, at least kind of shift that perspective a little bit, so that it can get you started on that path.

[00:04:02] Renee: We really do need some strategy, we need to like, get scrappy sometimes and we also need to remember what we're putting out, what kind of beacon we're putting out.

[00:04:13] Renee: You know, I always tell people like, what's your radio station tuning to? Because we're all putting something out 

[00:04:19] Jackie: Absolutely. 

[00:04:20] Renee: And we can decide what that is, and our thoughts and our feelings really kind of determine that.

[00:04:25] Jackie: Yeah. And, our brains are lazy, right? So they're looking for proof of our thoughts. They're basically trying to prove our thoughts. 

[00:04:32] Renee: No, it'll find proof of whatever you believe. That's it.

[00:04:36] Jackie: Yeah. I remember years ago being in the car with the three kids driving, you know, they were pretty little. And I said, “I'm gonna drive two blocks. I want you to pick out all the red cars, like count all the red cars from this point to that point.”

[00:04:51] Jackie: And they did. And then when we finished, you know, the drive, and I said, “How many white cars did you find?” They said, “Well, mommy, you said red cars.” And I said, “Uh, yeah, so you didn't, you don't know how many white cars.” And they were just like, “What's wrong with this woman? She's crazy.” but I was saying like, “What you are looking for, you will find. What you are seeking, you will see.”

[00:05:14] Jackie: And so if you are looking for negativity in the world, and that was my whole point to this whole exercise, was if you're looking for negativity, if you're looking for pain, if you're looking for life sucks, you'll find it. Oh, there are many, many examples of it. But if you're looking for something better for yourself, you'll also find that.

[00:05:35] Jackie: And so to me that's like, they're cars. It's not like, I mean, that to me is not all that woo-woo because you know, they’re just cars.

[00:05:42] Renee: Well, it's also science too, because that's the reticular activating system in the brain. That's the part of the brain that does that. It literally, like you will look, you will find exactly what you are focused on and there's a lot of different ways to say it. Energy flows where focus goes, you know, whatever you focus on will grow, that's what they mean by that. And I love that you did that with your kids, by the way. That's awesome.

[00:06:05] Jackie: Thanks. 

[00:06:06] Jackie: When I first met you, you know, your kids are a little bit older than mine, but you were taking photos, you were a photographer, you were doing the thing, you were definitely hustling. Um, and you are someone I admire so much in that you never stop taking action.

[00:06:20] Jackie: You take action on where you wanna go. Like, you're very clear on this is what I want, and then you go and get it. And so you were taking a lot of photos.

[00:06:29] Jackie: You took our family photos, then through the years you've shifted into this coaching side of it. And a lot of women, a lot of grown ass creatives, struggle with that shift, with that knowing first of all that I can do more than what I'm doing. Was there an “Aha!” moment or just like a slow progression from taking photos to starting to coach other creatives and other photographers?

[00:06:56] Renee: Yeah, I think it was kind of a slow progression for me. I mean, well with an “Aha!” moment, like at the end of it, I guess. Well first of all, now that I'm much older, I can look back and see like I was always a little bit all over the place with what I wanted to do with my life.

[00:07:11] Renee: Right. And you know, I've become a little neuro-spicy just like everybody else. 

[00:07:15] Jackie: Wait, wait.

[00:07:15] Jackie: Hold on. Neuro-spicy? What does that mean?

[00:07:19] Renee: Neuro divergent, probably on the ADHD spectrum somewhere. I've never been formally diagnosed with anything and I do feel like I have really good executive functioning skills and stuff like that.

[00:07:28] Renee: You know, us autism moms know these terms, right? Well, I now can look back and see like all of these different paths that I wanted to take and all of these little different like quirks things that I do, I'm like, uh yeah, I think I might be somewhere on that neuro-spicy field. It's like a little TikTok term.

[00:07:45] Renee: Most people say it on TikTok. I think it's cute. I love it, because it's like, yeah, I'm a little spicy. My brain might be a little spicier than yours or vice versa. And I think that we all learn very differently, right?

[00:07:56] Jackie: Mm.

[00:07:57] Renee: So looking back, you know, my whole life, I never really, like, had a clearer, like as a kid, oh, I wanna be this, I just was interested in a lot of different things and I was always geared more toward the arts.

[00:08:12] Renee: I used to draw and I can draw, like, really really well. And so when I went to college, I don't know about you, but back in our day, I didn't have a lot of guidance going into college. It was just like, you're going cuz your dad and I didn't go and you- that's what you're doing.

[00:08:30] Renee: And I was like, yeah, that's cool. College would be fun. You know, I went to LSU. It was a super big party. I didn't really have a clear vision of what I wanted to do, so I entered as like a fine arts. Quickly realized it just didn't excite me enough. There wasn't enough there. So I think I went to interior design after that.

[00:08:49] Renee: And then I switched gears completely and said, no, I'm going into psychology. Cuz I loved psychology, like just learning on my own. So I started taking some psych classes and realized, “Oh yeah, like this is really, really cool.” So I ended up getting a degree in psychology and with the intention obviously of going back at some point to be a therapist, like get my masters, do the thing.

[00:09:09] Renee: Then I moved to LA and I mean, I've had many jobs that whole time. You know, I was always bartending, waiting tables, hustling, making money. I was- I've been working since I was like sixteen and um, I moved to LA because I had the bright idea that maybe I would be an actress, maybe I could move to LA and be an actor, even though I had never done it before.

[00:09:34] Jackie: Isn't youth amazing?

[00:09:36] Renee: Yes. And I was just, you know, I was 25. It wasn't like I was even like straight outta college. I was working with a company that sold oil and gas bonds to, like, insurance companies. I had my insurance license. All this stuff. I was going down this corporate sort of path, right?

[00:09:53] Renee: And I literally woke up one day and I was like, “What the actual heck am I doing with my life? This is not me. What am I doing? I have to leave.” And I love my family. And it was not easy to move, as, you know, cross country. It's a big deal, but it was a huge turning point in my life, and so it brought me to LA. Quickly realized that acting was hard and I didn't know what I was doing, and so I was waiting tables and bartending.

[00:10:17] Renee: So I went back to massage school. I decided, “Okay, I love this whole mind body connection. I was always really fascinated with how we kind of, like, have trauma living in our bodies and how we can kind of get through that.” And I had been in therapy already because your girl needed therapy at a really young age, and my mom had the forethought to put me in therapy.

[00:10:35] Renee: And so I had all this background. I was like, “Oh, wouldn't it really be cool if, like, you could come up with some kind of therapy where it was body work and therapy.” Well, this is like in the early nineties. First of all, they do that now, but that is not the case then. And so that was my intention going to this massage therapy school.

[00:10:54] Renee: But then I ended up working as a massage therapist for a long time. So all of this to say, my first love, I think has always really been “How does this all work, right? How do we live? What is our point for being here?” All of these, like, big questions that I always had. So as I started my photography business, which I absolutely loved, cuz it was creative, it was on my own terms, et cetera.

[00:11:16] Renee: People started asking me, “How do you do that? How did you know that you wanted to do this and how do you know what to charge and how do you…” So it was kind of like I fell into the mentoring and the coaching first. Like I kind of fell into the photography thing then it was like, “Oh, this actually is bringing me a lot of joy. Working with other women, especially female photographers, creatives who also need a path and also are having these questions.”

[00:11:43] Renee: So that's when I decided to go back and get certified to be a life coach, to actually, you know, I'm not gonna kind of do things halfway. That's my thing. And it's been a really cool journey. So, I feel like I'm able to use my psychology in a lot of ways. I feel like I've definitely used that all along with my kids.

[00:12:06] Renee: I had no idea how handy that was gonna come in. Um, but I feel like, you know, I'm definitely not a therapist and I don't claim to be a therapist, but I do have a lot of working knowledge of that world. So that helps.

[00:12:20] Jackie: Yeah. You're one of those examples of a lifelong learner. Every time I talked to you, you took another class, or you learned a new skill, and you incorporate it It's funny because people think like, “Oh, somebody else is already doing this thing that I wanna do.”

[00:12:37] Jackie: And what I see in you is that you make it even more Renee with your expertise and your skill and all the things that you are sort of morphing into your work, there is no comparison because you're the most you you can possibly be.

[00:12:53] Jackie: Would you agree with that?

[00:12:54] Renee: That's what I hope to be, you know what I mean? Because I, that's what I strive to be. I've always felt a little bit on the outside of things, you know? Um, yeah, I was a cheerleader in high school. I never felt like I fit in, like I never felt like I belong. Yeah. Yeah. And it's, and maybe I don't know it, looking back, it was like, I was always kind of a little bit of this non-conformist and kind of pushing people, like, to think, whether it be like with clothes or wearing things, because I'm from the south, you know? I'm from like the deep south, and so there's a lot of tradition and things like that that exist there that I just never identified with, like ever.

[00:13:37] Renee: So, I feel like I've always wanted to be the most me, but I've also been searching for what that is, like who that really is. And it's honestly only now at 52 that I can really say, “Yeah, I do feel like me right now. I feel like I am living on my terms and doing the things that I wanna do, and if it's not a ‘Hell yes,’ it's, it's a no.” A couple years ago, I couldn't even really say that, to be honest with you. Like, I think that obviously the last three years have been super pivotal for most of us. But I don't know. I, I feel like. I'm glad that that is something that you see, because I often wonder if that is, you know, I, I, I talk about that all the time.

[00:14:25] Renee: Like that's what I want for people. I want for the people that I work with. To understand that if you want some kind of visibility in your, your business and your life, then you do, all you have to really do is just be you. Just be the most you, you, that you can be. Because, you know, it's so cliche everybody else is taken, but it's true, like if you try and fit in with everybody else, how could you possibly stand out in any kind of market? Really?

[00:14:51] Jackie: You're absolutely right. And so one of the things that you know all about Grown Ass creative, just being in the same space with these women who have so much experience, whether it's building websites or writing or recording or photography or, you know, I'm just blown away by the talent.

[00:15:09] Jackie: And then we get to a certain point. Where we start questioning like, “Is this all right?” So you took the photography business, you added the coaching. You're constantly mentoring. If you're not following Renee on TikTok and Instagram, you're really missing out. I will link to those in the show notes, but what kind of advice would you give to someone who feels like they're in this space?

[00:15:31] Jackie: Maybe they're not as relevant. In this space anymore, or they feel at least that they're not as relevant in this space. They know there's more, but you know, not everybody can take a leap. Not everyone, I'm all about like, if it's not a hell yes, and you still gotta pay the bills, you still gotta sometimes say yes to things that aren't a hell yes or feel like you have to say yes to it. What kind of advice would you give?

[00:15:55] Renee: I do agree with that, but I also believe that when you fully are living in that place of alignment with who you are, then the universe has no choice but to give you what you want. I know that sounds really dumbed down and simple, but. I've seen so much proof of it. That's the hardest part though.

[00:16:14] Renee: That is the hardest part for people to really get, because we are so entrenched in this, like, 3D world because we live in it. But this is not the thing. This is not all there is. We are really not just cogs in a wheel. We can choose to believe that we are. We can choose to believe that a recession's gonna, like, kill everything.

[00:16:32] Renee: We can choose to believe that the world is falling apart or we can choose to not believe that. And yeah, rose colored glasses, a lot of people will say, well that's, you know, must be nice. At the same time, I feel like that is the only thing that has gotten me through like some of the hardest periods, is to really be in full trust 

[00:16:53] Renee: Does this bring me joy? Is this something that really feels good to me? Then obviously this is what I need to be doing, wanna be doing, and obviously the universe is gonna provide. I know that's kind of a whole woo topic, but I get it.

[00:17:08] Renee: There's this, again, the balance and, and the living and the reality versus living in the world that you want to live in. Your reality, creating your own reality, creating your own world, creating your own future. But the thing about that it takes a decent amount of, first of all, I think self-awareness, to know where you are.

[00:17:29] Renee: Like that's really key is to kind of know yourself and to be really honest with yourself about what you're doing. And, I think a lot of people tend to maybe not shine a light as bright on themselves. As they probably could in that respect on, what are my true motivations for this?

[00:17:48] Renee: Is that really- is that my ego? Do I want that? Cuz cuz I want the ego hit? Or do I really want that for, like, a higher purpose reason kind of thing. Really kind of checking in with yourself, but also having the clarity on knowing where you wanna go is really, really important.

[00:18:03] Renee: And I think a lot of women at this stage in our lives also, we have kind of lived our lives for so many people, right? A lot of us have. And so it's really hard to even uncover that identity I think after so many years of putting it aside. So that's the other thing that I see a lot happen as well.

[00:18:24] Renee: And, and then you have to sort of unlearn a lot of that if it makes sense, right? , you kind of have decided that these are the hats that I'm gonna wear, and that might not be your hat at all. Like it's probably someone else's story.

[00:18:38] Renee: You know, you kind of get to a point where it's like, is this really my story?

[00:18:42] Renee: Is have I been really living for the, the way that I wanna live or, or have I lived to just get through to pay the bills to make sure my kids have this to, and it's so easy to get cycled into that because it's the world we live in. So it takes a great deal of habit and practice to stay in that mindset, that word gets thrown around a lot.

[00:19:05] Renee: But that's really kind of what it's about, is what are you doing daily to ensure that you are living the life you wanna live? Do you journal every day? Do you go for a walk? Do you meditate? Do you do hypnosis? Whatever it is that is your thing, it doesn't have to be this long process,

[00:19:20] Jackie: Yeah. And it could be just one.

[00:19:22] Renee: It could be just one simple five minute thing, but are you doing it daily? Are you committed to it or are you going to just, like, allow yourself to just be taken into consumption, the first minute of waking? You know what I mean? So I guess take it back to your question.

[00:19:39] Renee: I kind of went around the block, but I would tell someone, you know specifically who. in terms of, like, the switching gears that you were talking about, like kind of going from one thing to another. It's really easy, especially as women, to feel an imposter syndrome creep in when that happens because it's like, well, who am I to do this?

[00:19:58] Renee: There's so many these, there's so many coaches, there's so many of this, but nobody is you. And that's what it really comes down to is the reason why you will make a difference. And the reason why you will have success with it is because no one is saying what you wanna say. You know, I mean…

[00:20:17] Jackie: Yeah. In the way that you say it.

[00:20:19] Renee: In the way that you say it, but you have to believe that.

[00:20:22] Renee: There has to be a belief that drives you forward. I really believe that I do believe that also goes back to your purpose. So I would highly suggest people, if you haven't done this in a while, is to really visit or revisit your why and your purpose and go very deep with it.

[00:20:42] Renee: And not just like in terms of, “Why do I wanna be a successful coach? Or “Why do I wanna be a successful X, Y, Z, whatever that is, fill in the blank.”

[00:20:50] Jackie: Mm-hmm. 

[00:20:52] Renee: But outside of what you do, right? Simon's Neck is like the end all be all for me on this. Like if you haven't listened to that, YouTube, his TED Talk, fFnd your Why or read his book, you guys, oh my God.

[00:21:06] Renee: I would highly suggest diving into that because people will buy why you do it and not what you do, but also you have to have this purpose. You have to know what that is so that it keeps you going in those times of stress and having to pay the bills.

[00:21:22] Jackie: Yeah. And you know, it is a buzzword, “purpose,” right? But that word purpose, I think is as motivating as it is, as like, ahhh, no thank you. I don't know what it is. I'm gonna run the other way.

[00:21:36] Jackie: You know, it's such a big word, how does one find their purpose? What does that even mean, 

[00:21:41] Jackie: I mean, I, you know, I have mine because, because for me, like, and here's the thing. My purpose is to talk about the shit that people feel and they're afraid to say out loud and get some experts on and, and get some others.

[00:21:56] Jackie: So we can all go like, oh, this isn't as complicated as we make it. Like, here's some, here's some strategies. I got you. That my purpose, is just to connect with other women and help them see the grown-assery in them. Right. So it doesn't have to be like I'm not curing a rare disease here.

[00:22:13] Jackie: It's just I know with my experience that all the things that I've gone through in my life that I'm meant to speak about them, so other people feel less alone.

[00:22:22] Renee: absolutely. Well, and I think you find it by doing. You find it by doing. That's why the action is important. So many people just sit around and think about, “Oh, I wish I could do this, or I wish I could do that.” But they don't actually take a step because they want it to be perfect. You gotta do it messy.

[00:22:37] Renee: You gotta just start doing something, even if it's not like one thing that I always have on a sticky note is what's the next right step? Like you don't need to see. You know, okay, in five years I would like to have… you know what I mean? Like, yeah, that'd be, yeah, great. If you have that kind of clarity, whatever, but most people don't, you know, and most people are just wanting to take a step.

[00:22:58] Renee: So what's the next right step? If you have an idea for something, first of all, if you have an idea for something, if you have an idea of what your life, like, you want it to be like, or if you think, oh, that would be really cool. It's already happened in another dimension. The other you have has already done it.

[00:23:14] Renee: So by proxy you can totally have that because it's you wouldn't have even thought about it if it wasn't a possibility. So now it's just about whether you're gonna take a step toward it or away from it. And that's just, you know, that's a whole other discussion on fear. But, I do think purpose is a really big word, and I think that it can be really scary for a lot of people.

[00:23:34] Renee: And I love that you broke it down into fairly simple term, but it's also a really big deal, right? The ripple effect of that purpose is huge. And it can be huge for many, many people, but you can't think about it in terms like that when you're thinking about it, purpose, because it's just too big for our brains to comprehend.

[00:23:51] Renee: So, What is the next right step in the direction of, what you feel called to do and you do find your purpose by actually taking action, by doing things.

[00:24:01] Jackie: That's brilliant because if, you know, if you're feeling like you wanna be an interior designer, you mentioned that earlier, go and help a friend, see if that's really something you wanna spend more time doing.

[00:24:11] Jackie: One of the things that I love is that you didn't take photos and then you just jumped into coaching. You straddle both worlds. I mean, it's all actually one world. That's the beauty of it. But, there are plenty of people out there who might wanna do something different or elevate what they're doing.

[00:24:27] Renee: Mm-hmm. 

[00:24:28] Jackie: It's not like this step to this step, which you're probably not even watching me put my hand over my head right now. But, it's like you said, integration. And so if someone is listening now and is like, this is what I do now, it's okay with the world's not ending. I'm okay with it, but I do want to either add to it or, or merge into something else.

[00:24:50] Jackie: How do we do that in those baby steps? How do we take that action?

[00:24:54] Renee: Yeah, that's a really great question. And also, you never see the contrast without doing that. That's the other point of it. It's not just about taking action so that you can find, yes, this is what I wanna do. It's so that you can see Uh Uh. That ain't for me. That's not for me, the contrast is just as important.

[00:25:11] Renee: And so many people wanna avoid the contrast because it's uncomfortable. And so I think knowing that going in like, yeah, you may try something and it might not be for you. Like it may not, I was coaching someone the other day and she was like, you know, amazing photographer and she's positioned herself to do what I do to even like, go further with that and kind of be a photography educator.

[00:25:34] Renee: And we were discussing that over the course of coaching, and one of the things that came up for her was that this is not for me. I don't wanna do that but until she was in it and doing some of it, she would never have known that. And it's completely okay to change your mind, first of all. Give yourself permission to change your mind, because we can do that at any point.

[00:25:57] Renee: So that's the first thing is that, know that as you take these steps, you might find that it isn't for you, and that is extremely important and valuable information. So be grateful for that as well and shift your gears. be willing to pivot, be willing to flow, be willing to, let go. It's the letting go that's so freaking hard for most people, and so many women letting go of the control, letting go of it has to be this way or, or, or I can't do it.

[00:26:30] Renee: Um, giving yourself permission to really do it messy and to make some mistakes, that's like really the first thing. And then as far as taking the actual steps, like you said, if you are drawn to something, you have an idea about something, how can you access it without signing up for a whole course or, you know what I mean?

[00:26:48] Renee: What's a smaller thing that you can do? Maybe you can mentor with somebody like, or apprentice, or maybe you can just shadow someone or maybe you can, take some free classes online. There's a lot of college classes actually for free online now. What about that, could at least give you some kind of introduction to it cuz you may not even have ever done it before. You might have just had this idea, right? So find out first if you even like it, and then what's the next right step from there. Okay? Is this something I actually want to make a business out of? Okay. Kind of have to do the business things. Now I've gotta get my license and you know, do all those, all those things.

[00:27:27] Renee: And if that's something that you're lacking in, you need to find somebody to help you with that. That's the fastest way to do it.

[00:27:32] Jackie: Yeah, for sure. So one of the things that I have noticed about you that has really shifted my whole perspective. So when I was young, Like you, I started working. I think I was, well, I started delivering newspapers at 10. I had my first taxes taken out at 13, my first job at 13.

[00:27:55] Jackie: I knew how to make money, right? I would have, in college, I would have four jobs at a time if like, oh, if you can't get me enough hours, I'm gonna go over here and get more hours. I'm a worker. I make shit happen. That being said, you get to a certain point, right, where you're like, okay, now I'm aging out, now I'm irrelevant.

[00:28:11] Jackie: Now I'm this, now I'm that. And you start listening to all these stories. Some of them coming from inside the house, some of them coming from other people. and so there might be somebody listening who wants to move into something else. They want to do something else. One of the things that you still do, and I've seen you do it, like you're like, oh, my kid is going to this college. I need to make this much money this month extra to handle this bill or to do that. And then you create a plan, and then you go out and you bring that in and it's like, whew.

[00:28:40] Jackie: Especially as a creative, right? We're supposed to be quote unquote starving artists? So what are some ways that my listeners could make money today? Today, as a creative, as a grown-ass creative, they may not be thinking about.

[00:28:55] Renee: Maybe it's born of necessity that I've kind of always been that way, but I also, really do believe that abundance is everywhere and there's enough for everyone, and why not me? 

[00:29:07] Jackie: Yeah. 

[00:29:07] Renee: Right. Like, Yeah. 

[00:29:08] Renee: I mean I've definitely been working almost my whole life as well.

[00:29:11] Renee: And you know, even in college I had multiple jobs as well. I love making money and that was something that I had to get real with myself about when I actually created my photography business. Cuz up until then it was like, yeah, I know how to make money. I can. You know, I can just go get a job.

[00:29:26] Renee: But then when I started realizing, oh, I can actually like not rely on anybody else for that. I can rely on myself to make money? Sign me up. It was like mainlining a drug. I was so on board with that cuz I am so not wanting to work for anyone. It was very intoxicating for me when I realized I had the power all along.

[00:29:47] Renee: So I feel like. That comes from a couple different places. Like I said, I do think that if you have this belief that there's lack and there's not enough in the world, and if you really start to believe that, then again you're gonna find proof of it, right? Like just like we were talking about.

[00:30:05] Renee: But if you have this belief that maybe that's not really the case, maybe what if I could make an extra two grand this month? Even just allowing that question to pop into your mind is a really powerful thing to look at because most people don't even allow that to happen. So from there, all kinds of possibilities can come from, but you have to have the question, I believe you have to have the desire and you also have a teeny, tiny belief that it's possible for it to happen.

[00:30:34] Renee: And then you can come up with some cool strategies. Like, what am I good at and what am I naturally good at? If people tell me, first of all, if people tell you the same thing over and over again over time, right? That's a sign. So what have people told you in your life that you're good at?

[00:30:49] Renee: What if people tell you, you know, like, oh, you're really good at this. Are you really good at that? Okay. Can you figure out a way to make some extra money at that? Maybe if it's just like, take a little bit of action in that direction to see if that's something you'd even be willing to do?

[00:31:02] Renee: Or maybe you already have a business or courses. I see this a lot. I see a lot of people who have created things and kind of just have this vault of content, let's just say that. They just really haven't done a lot with, okay. Can you sell that? Can you repackage it? Can you upsell it?

[00:31:21] Renee: Can you put an add on? Can you downsell it? Like there's all sorts of strategies that in sales that you can position offers. Can you create digital products? Is there an idea that you have for a recipe or a recipe book or a fitness plan, or, you know, whoever it is, like, can you make it into an ebook?

[00:31:40] Renee: Can you make it into a digital product? Can you. Sell that online. Can you talk about it? That's the thing that a lot of people don't like to do is talk about their stuff. So showing up for yourself is a really, really big part of that. But maybe there's other businesses in your community who are also trying to get the attention of the same client, the same target audience as you.

[00:32:02] Renee: How can you combine your efforts? And maybe work with them to create a product or a service or an experience that they can't get anywhere else. And there's power in numbers, right? So like, it's not just you by yourself anymore. Now you've got someone else that's gonna help you do that. That's a really good way to, to just kind of bring in.

[00:32:21] Renee: then just like, just diversifying really just being open to the possibility and “What about this have I not considered?” is something I kind of like to ask myself a lot is, what am I missing here? there's gotta be something and, and allowing yourself.

[00:32:37] Renee: Also this space to dream about that. So a lot of people live in this, this doing, doing, doing. You and I are both doers. We know that human design generators, we will get shit done, but there's no prize at the end for that. You know, we'd win, but there's no prize at the end. And so something I've had to learn and a lot of us have to learn is that we have to give ourselves the space to actually have those ideas come in and drop in. And you can't do that with a dysregulated nervous system. You can't do that when you're living in fight or flight. you can't come up with these really cool ideas about how to make extra money when you're like, oh my god, I am literally in survival mode 24 7.

[00:33:21] Renee: So that's why I harp on regulating a nervous system any way that you can, whether that be. meditation, hypnosis, exercise, whatever it is, it's gonna be able to let your body release what you've been holding onto and regulate your nervous system and get back and rest and digest instead of fight or flight.

[00:33:40] Renee: That needs to come before you can really come up with these ideas, because most often, when you regulate, it happens organically. That's just the precursor and one of the biggest things for me is walks, long walks. I love my long walks because that's when I get the best ideas.

[00:34:00] Renee: And I don't go for those walks knowing I'm gonna come up with the best idea today. I just go, because I know I need to, I'm gonna feel better, it's good for me. And that's when my mind just opens. So you have to find what works for you. But man, there's so many different ways to make money. There's so many different ways.

[00:34:16] Renee: You can sell your stuff. Like what in your house have you not used? Outside of people who haven't even run businesses, like maybe you haven't even started a business. You work a nine to five and you just need to bring in some extra money. What's some freelance work that you can pick up?

[00:34:28] Renee: Are you good at social media? Maybe some of your friends need some extra social media work. You can post for them, or maybe there's stuff in your house that you can sell. Maybe you can start a Poshmark store. That's huge right now. Thrifting is huge in sustainability. 

[00:34:41] Jackie: Yeah.

[00:34:42] Renee: There's a ton of different ways that you can bring in extra money, but you've gotta kind of like, at least be willing to believe that it's a possibility first, and then be regulated enough to take the action.

[00:34:55] Jackie: Yeah, and you don't have to do it perfectly. Like I stumbled upon this paint that we've redone some furniture. I'm not very good at it at all, but I'm in this group and I see all these other people in the group and they'll take like an end table off the side of the road and then they'll use this particular paint and they'll make it look nice and then sell it for $200.

[00:35:16] Jackie: It's so fascinating because I think when we get in that state of, I don't have enough, it's hard to imagine being in a state where you do.

[00:35:27] Renee: Yeah. And for most people, let's be fair too, a lot of people anyway, I think that, they may have had a whole lifetime. Like that, that could be the story from their childhood as well where there wasn't enough. And you know, that is a very real thing. So I'm not trying to gloss over that.

[00:35:43] Renee: But I definitely have seen many people, not just in my coaching business, but in the world, who have come from nothing and come from extreme hardships and built amazing lives for 

[00:35:55] Renee: themselves. And they had to have had at least had a belief that that could happen. I do think that there has to be there, somewhere deep down, because how else would you want to want more, right? Like what would keep you going? What would keep you reaching if, if you really believed everything around you? And so usually that's what you hear is that these people who do come from very difficult situations and have great thriving businesses and lives, it's because they had a belief that they could do it or they wanted something better and it was greater than their fear.

[00:36:33] Jackie: Yeah. I mean, you see it every day, right? I mean, that's the beauty of the internet is you see like, some guy coming out of foster care who's going to Harvard. Harvard, you know, Harvard, Harvard, um, my Boston accent was like, oh, come on. Um, and. Yeah, and then you see like, you know, a woman who was maybe struggling with her health, who's now 80 and winning bodybuilding competitions.

[00:36:55] Jackie: Like there are so many people where you're absolutely right. It's like they had this idea and they didn't get from zero to sixty overnight. They just showed up and they kept showing up, which is amazing. I will tell you that even my podcast, you know, you know, I spent 25 something years in TV, but like, I was doing a podcast, I was not coaching people about podcasts.

[00:37:17] Jackie: I was not producing other people's podcasts. And somebody had posted in a group, like a blog or group or something like, “Does anyone know a podcast coach?” And someone tagged me and I was like, I don't do that. And I was like, okay, I can help you. You know? And I remember like charging, it was the very first time I was like, I'll work with you for a month.

[00:37:38] Jackie: I'll charge you $400. You know, like, and now it was like, I couldn't even imagine charging that little, but at the same time, I knew what I was doing. Just because I didn't have experience doing what they were asking for didn't mean that I didn't have enough experience to teach. You know, And I think about those women who are really, really gifted at decorating, which is so not me when it comes to actual creative, artistic things, it's not me at all. could you charge $50 a person, tell them to come into your house with a fully baked cake of this size, and then you teach them how to decorate it. You know, it's like I love talking with you because the possibilities, I'm reminded that the possibilities are endless regardless.

[00:38:21] Jackie: There, there's something that you do that you think is so, and I'm talking to you listener, there's something you do. That you think everybody knows how to do, or there's a gift you have that you're like, yeah, it's no big deal. It is a big deal. It is something that is uniquely you that other people could benefit from, so please do not discount that.

[00:38:40] Renee: Yeah, it's easy for you because you're good at it. That's what most people don't realize is like, “Oh, that's just easy.” Well, no, it's easy for you because you're good at it. That's not something that everybody else can do. And you're right. Like I tell people that all the time, like, You can just throw together a beta program like that for anything.

[00:38:58] Renee: Okay. I bet you could find within your circle four to five women who would want to learn what it is that you're really good at. You can charge 'em a little bit of money for it because it's a beta program. You film it and then you've got content and then you can start scaling that business from there.

[00:39:15] Renee: That's a whole different story, but you gotta at least just start. And what's cool about your story too is that when someone tags you, It's like, yeah, I know that I have this skill and I can do it, but when someone else believes in you, when someone else has that belief, even like maybe even stronger than you, like if you've got people in your life who are always telling you stuff like that, like why are you not doing that?

[00:39:34] Renee: You gotta start listening. You gotta start listening.

[00:39:37] Jackie: That’s such a good point. 

[00:39:38] Renee: Put that fear aside.

[00:39:39] Jackie: Yes. And you know, if you want a little action item from this episode, go tag somebody in a post that you believe in and show her that, like you think, oh, she could do this, she's awesome at this. Or just something like, go tag somebody in something. Just do it.

[00:39:53] Renee: Yeah. cause you never know what kind of difference that's gonna make for somebody. Honestly, I mean, just in general. I think that that's such a good practice to be in. Like, texting people out of the blue and letting 'em know what they mean to you, or, tagging them on social and saying, this reminded me of you.

[00:40:08] Renee: Just those kinds of things just make such a big difference and it lifts your energetic vibe exponentially. It puts you in such a place of gratefulness.

[00:40:18] Jackie: Absolutely. And you never know if that person was about to give up. You never know if that person was like, I can't do that. That's not something- and then that one thing, I mean, I've told the story many times that there was a guy on LinkedIn who basically just wanted to hire me and then he saw my grown ass branding and he was like, that's not for me.

[00:40:41] Jackie: I want someone wholesome and blah, blah, blah. And I was like, oh, I am not for you. But he was a huge catalyst in my creating Grown-Ass Creative.

[00:40:50] Jackie: Not outta spite or any sort of anger, but as, “Oh, yeah, you know what? I have something to say and I can help these other women who have something to say and, and so much relevance, and if it gets people feeling some real feels about it, then I know I'm doing the right thing.”

[00:41:07] Renee: Absolutely. a hundred percent. And you have to be open to that. That's the thing. It's like, that's part of the letting go. It's being open to receiving that kind of information too. Because you could have very easily, you know, if you’re a closed off person and you’re in a state of lack and constriction, something like that would've happened, and it would've turned you in the complete opposite direction.

[00:41:28] Renee: You could have, it could, you could have allowed it to skew your point of view, right? And so that is really important as well, like being open to, like I was saying before, like what's really going on here? Becoming this neutral observer of your life is like my goal in life, is to become the neutral observer because most often we're just really too close to something and it's too charged, right?

[00:41:57] Renee: And so, okay, I gotta take the charge out of this. Like it's just a thing, let me step away from it. And there's a lot of different ways you can do that, but like when you are this neutral observer and you're really looking at it without judgment, when you're not judging yourself, because let's just face it like we are so judgmental on ourselves.

[00:42:14] Renee: Like, Oh my God. And if we can learn to redirect those thoughts and get back to, no, no, no, no. I'm just gonna observe this. It's just a thing. It is what it is. I did that. Okay. Or this happened, right? How am I really feeling about this? Am I really upset about it? Or could this be something cool?

[00:42:34] Renee: Could this be something good? What is the takeaway from this, ultimately? And allowing yourself just the space to be open to it. And so many people just don't even do that. So if you have even just a little bit of that skill, like you're way ahead of the game.

[00:42:47] Jackie: Yeah. You're absolutely right. Like one of the notes I wrote to myself years ago that I kept posted on, a cork board was “Respond, not react.” And that was actually a note for me with my kids, with three little kids, you know, was “Respond, not react.” And it rings true today. Take a second, breathe, respond.

[00:43:08] Jackie: But it's the reaction. It's that charged place where…

[00:43:11] Renee: When you're not regulated, you're gonna react. Like so when you are not regulated and you are not sleeping enough. How many moms don't sleep enough? I'm sorry. I look back on the years of raising my kids and I'm like, I don't know how I survived on like five and a half hours of sleep.

[00:43:28] Renee: Like if I don't get eight hours of sleep, don't come near me. For years I would stay up late because I was just like, no, this is my time and I don't have time to do this in the daytime, so I'm gonna stay up late and do it, and then I would be exhausted. If you are not regulated, not sleeping, not taking care of yourself, not doing the things that you know are going to keep you in a good state.

[00:43:51] Renee: You're not good for anybody, and you're definitely not gonna come up with good ideas on how to make money, and you're not gonna be a good parent. It really is a very simple thing that very many people just don't do.

[00:44:00] Jackie: Yeah. Totally right. There's the takeaway of this episode. So, two more things. Number one, what can we expect from your new podcast Tried and True with a Dash of Woo?

[00:44:12] Renee: So, as you know, for years I've been toying about the idea and I think that I just kind of got stuck along the way in a lot of different paths, I guess because I couldn't figure out like, well, I wanna talk about this and I wanna talk about this and I wanna talk about this. And I finally just take my own advice and be like, I can allow this to be whatever it is going to be.

[00:44:32] Renee: I'm gonna let it kind of breathe. Yes, I'm gonna go in with an intention and that's why I named it Tried and True with a dash of Woo because I wanna talk about strategies and things that we can actually implement and things that we can actually do in our lives and take action on that we know work, but also the science of the unconscious mind and also the woo and the magic of life because I really believe we need to have all of that.

[00:44:56] Renee: And sometimes we have more of one than the other, and that's okay. So there's gonna be some solo episodes where I talk about things like overthinking or perfectionism or whatever and, life coaching kind of things with takeaways on that. And then there's gonna be some where I have guests and we talk about specific topics and I'm just kinda letting it be what it's going to be right now.

[00:45:19] Renee: And I'm having a lot of fun doing it. And that's really kind of all I'm focused on right now is like, is this fun? Is this something that, you know, I really enjoy doing? And obviously, hopefully I want it to be valuable. So that's kind of where I'm at with it. And it's gonna be exciting.

[00:45:35] Jackie: I will definitely link to it in the show notes. You're just amazing and the perfect balance. Seriously, it's the perfect name of a podcast for you because that's exactly what I see in you. Like, you know how to take action. You've coached me on taking action and making things happen, and also getting out of your own way.

[00:45:54] Jackie: I think that the combination of those two things, or the integration of those two things is so important. 

[00:46:00] Renee: Thank you. 

[00:46:01] Jackie: So if somebody were to press play on this episode, 50 minutes into it, which would be weird, what is the one thing if somebody's listening that you wanna make sure that they get from this, from you today?

[00:46:15] Renee: Hmm. I guess the one thing would be, cause I do hear people say that all the time, is I just need to get outta my own way. Well, really, What I would like people to hear is to be just the most you that you can be, whatever that looks like. And that's how you get out of your own way because it is uncomfortable, it's not super fun sometimes to be the person that people are talking about or whatever.

[00:46:42] Renee: People are gonna talk about you no matter what. It's none of your business, right? So if you wanna do something, you've gotta be you. You've gotta be willing to show up for yourself. If you have a hard time doing that for yourself. I want you to think about little you, right? What she would've wanted you to do.

[00:46:59] Renee: Right? Be her cheerleader. At least find a way basically to get it done for yourself because you have to be your biggest cheerleader. 

Thank you so much for listening. If you haven't yet shared the Grown-Ass Woman's Guide with a friend, now is the perfect time. And if you feel inspired, please leave a rating and review on Apple Podcasts. I would appreciate it so much. 

Until next time, you are a Grown-Ass woman. Act accordingly.